Finding Financial Clarity in Uncertain Times

By Modern Wealth Management

June 9, 2022

Finding Financial Clarity in Uncertain Times

Key Points – Finding Financial Clarity in Uncertain Times

  • Financial Clarity Begins with a Financial Plan
  • Frequent Communication with Your Advisor During Uncertain Times Is Critical
  • How Does Inflation Factor into a Financial Plan?
  • What Can We Expect Next from the Fed?
  • 21 minutes to read | 38 minutes to listen

With all the issues we’re facing domestically and globally that are impacting the economy, it’s pivotal to find financial clarity during these uncertain times. Bud Kasper and Logan DeGraeve talk about the importance of having a financial plan to navigate that uncertainty and help people reach their goals in retirement.

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Show Resources:

Find links to the resources Logan and Bud mentioned on this episode below.

How Do You Find Financial Clarity in Uncertain Times?

Bud Kasper: Hello everyone, and welcome to America’s Wealth Management Show. I’m Bud Kasper. Generally, I’m the co-host along with Dean Barber, but Dean is in a meeting that he had to attend. So, stepping into his big shoes is Logan DeGraeve. He’s one of our CERTIFIED FINANCIAL PLANNER™ Professionals at Modern Wealth Management. Good morning, Logan.

Logan DeGraeve: Morning, Bud. How are you?

Bud Kasper: I’m great. I’ve got so much to talk to you about today, and I’m anxious to hear your opinion on some of the activities that are going on. The purpose of our discussion today is to give certainty to the uncertainty of the economy.

The stock market, interest rates, gas prices, baby food, supply chain breakdown, Russia/Ukraine, the direction of the Federal Reserve, trillions of dollars of indebtedness, quantitative tightening, China worries, North Korea, and stressed-out retirees who are asking the question, “Do I really have enough to survive another downturn?”

The answer that Logan and I are going to discuss is, you won’t know without a comprehensive financial plan prepared by a CFP® Professional. At Modern Wealth Management, we have seven CFP® Professionals and one CFP® Professional candidate. They are available to our clients and prospective clients to discuss how to navigate all this market volatility. It’s our goal to help you find financial clarity during this economic uncertainty.

Through our planning process, we strive to provide a retirement planning result that is personalized to your unique situation. I want to go back to all the issues I mentioned that investors and financial planners alike are facing today. It gets overwhelming for people. But it’s our job to put this into perspective because people are desperately looking for financial clarity.

Finding Financial Clarity in a Forward-Looking Financial Plan

Logan DeGraeve: That’s right. Bud named a lot of bad things. I didn’t hear a lot of good things in what he listed, but that’s the reality of where we’re at. If you don’t have a financial plan, how do you know what has and hasn’t impacted you so far in 2022? Yes, your account values have gone down most likely, but does that mean that you can retire still? Does that mean you can’t retire?

That’s what we want to get at today is the benefit of working with a CFP® Professional and the financial clarity that a plan provides you to make sure that you’re not making emotional decisions. You can clear the noise because there was a lot of noise with everything Bud mentioned.

Have You Heard from Your Advisor Recently?

Bud Kasper: Exactly. One of the questions that I ask occasionally is, “Have you heard from your advisor?” I’ve been doing this for over 35 years. A lot of the people that come in that I’ve never met before are looking for second opinions. When a lot of people hear us about a comprehensive financial plan, they don’t understand the integrity that comes out of the plan that could really provide some answers for retirement.

The Different Examples of Financial Clarity

Logan DeGraeve: Here’s a perfect story that kind of relates to that. I met with a gentleman this week who has been a client for a while. He sometimes tends to worry about things that are going on, which is understandable, especially since he plans to retire at the end of this year.

However, after reviewing his plan, it was apparent that he could have retired at the end of last year. He can still retire at the end of this year. Without a proper financial plan, he would not have had the financial clarity to know that.

Here’s another example of receiving financial clarity. It’s summertime. What do people do in the summer? They take vacations. I have a few clients that want to take this big family trip that will cost between $25,000-$50,000. They want to know if they can take the trip. In most cases, the financial clarity that’s revealed from their plan shows that they absolutely can.

So Many Questions

Bud Kasper: You’re so right. So many people have questions, but they don’t have answers. And the reason they don’t have answers is that they are do-it-yourselfers and don’t have the comprehensive approach that you need to have. They probably have never done a financial plan and wouldn’t know how to do one if they even wanted to.

This creates a big void of uncertainty. That uncertainty is a hard thing to live with because now you’re questioning yourself, “Did I retire too early? Did I save enough money? Am I spending too much? Am I going to have to cut back? Will I have to cut back more than just a few months? Is this problem that we’re having globally? Is it going to impact me for years?” There are so many other questions as well.

Logan DeGraeve: When I see people with that anxiety, the picture is too close to their face right now. They’re too close to what’s going on with their own situation. It’s our job as financial planners to pull that back and really give them some financial clarity.

It’s in these times of uncertainty that CERTIFIED FINANCIAL PLANNER™ Professionals and financial advisors really earn their money. If you’re not hearing from your advisor and what the plan is with the markets, it might be a good time to get a second opinion.

Gaining Financial Clarity from the Guided Retirement System

Bud Kasper: We call our planning process at Modern Wealth Management the Guided Retirement System. It factors the necessary information that we need to garner from people who don’t have the right answers yet. There are a lot of people that are out there that call themselves planners, but I challenge that if they haven’t been through rigorous board exams required for CERTIFIED FINANCIAL PLANNER™ Professionals.

If you’re working with a CFP® Professional, God bless you. I think you’re on the right track by having that type of professional in your life. If you don’t have one in your life, you need to start thinking about it.

Logan DeGraeve: At the end of the day, there’s nothing wrong with getting a second opinion. I think that’s a good thing. Even if you’ve worked with someone for a while, get a second opinion. Make sure that you’re still on track and there’s nothing new that you need to look at.

Bud Kasper: So many people would not know what to look at to get the answers that they’re seeking. What we’re really looking for here are answers that are so critical at a time in a person’s life when they’re retiring. They’re going to have to rely on their savings and other resources such as Social Security, Medicare, all the other options. Just as important are taxes.

Some Scary Looking Headlines

We also want to talk more about some of those headlines that are in your face right now. And some of them are from people that we respect because of their longevity, education, and background. Jamie Dimon is well known in the banking industry. When he makes a comment that is so hyperbolic from the sense of that we are about to experience a hurricane of bad news, it puts everybody back on their heels.

Logan DeGraeve: It has to, Bud. There are a lot of headlines that are grabbing people’s attention, and a lot of the ones people are worried about involve inflation. That’s been on everyone’s mind since last year. It has taken a toll so far this year. Bud and I were just talking about the gasoline prices that we’re dealing with. It doesn’t look like that’s going to get better anytime soon.

Inflation Is Everywhere

Bud Kasper: Unfortunately, I don’t think it will. When Joe Biden restricted the pipelines, the prices of oil at that time weren’t high enough to gin the fracking back up. But we could have had some that was already somewhat sustainable. All they had to do was gin it up for what the need was going to be. We live with these crazy things every day.

Logan DeGraeve: But Bud, do you know who likes that? The electric car industry.

Bud Kasper: Well, they may until they find out about the grids and rolling blackouts and all the other things that they’re talking about in California, but who cares about California. They created their own problems with that.

But inflation is not just isolated to the United States. Europe is out of control on inflation. We’re in this together. And with the Russia and Ukraine situation, we’re seeing a unification of the European countries. Even a couple of new countries may be coming into NATO.

And let’s face it, what is Vladimir Putin really doing? He’s just destroying everything so that it’s unlivable to be in there. If you can’t live there, that means you’re not going to have an army that’s going to be created to give him any more trouble. That’s the action that he’s going to get. Who knows how this is going to end, but it’s a serious situation. And in this day and age, are you kidding me? We have a person that’s trying to grab more real estate? It just doesn’t make any sense to me.

How Inflation Factors into the Financial Plan

Logan DeGraeve: It doesn’t at all, Bud. It’s destroying the real estate before you may want it. But let’s talk about inflation and how that deals with the financial plan. Bud and I have seen a whole lot of people come through the door over the last 10 years that have said, “Well, we really haven’t had a whole lot of inflation, so I’m not going to plan for inflation in my financial plan. Or maybe I’ll plan at 1% or 2%.”

And all along we’ve said, “We’re not going to do it that way. We’re going to look at since 1970 moving forward.” In our financial plans, we’re looking at somewhere around 3.91% inflation just for your day-to-day living expenses. What that means is every year we plan on giving you a raise. If you don’t take that raise, that’s fine. That just means there’s more money to spend or more money left at the end of your plan.

But at the same time, make sure you’re not looking at the basket of goods at the grocery store and inflating them the same way as your health care costs. Because I can promise you that over the course of your retirement, healthcare is probably going to be your largest expense outside of maybe taxes. Health care costs are going to inflate closer to 6.9% in our financial software.

Factoring in 1% to 2% Inflation Won’t Work

If you were one of those people that wasn’t worried about inflation or only wanting to do 1% or 2%, you need to revisit that financial plan. Because we’re a long way from seeing 2% inflation again.

Bud Kasper: Excellent points. Rarely do I ever have somebody to come in to meet with me for the first time who already has a financial plan. But for those that have, the first thing that I do is look at what the inflation assumption that was used in the plan. I bet Logan does the same thing.

If I’m seeing 1.5%, 2%, I just hand it back because that won’t work. Your retirement is serious business. You don’t get do-overs in retirement. If you have an inflation number that looks cool and soothing, you’re not using today’s numbers. It’s an imperative to get realistic approaches to what we’re dealing with today.

Don’t Lie to Yourself and What’s Your Realized Real Return?

Logan DeGraeve: Two things there. One: It does no good to lie to yourself in your financial plan. You’re only hurting yourself.

Bud Kasper: And your family.

Logan DeGraeve: The second thing I care about in the financial plan when we’re projecting out long term is: What is the realized real return? What did you make on your investments, net of inflation, and what’s that real return? Because that’s really what we care about.

If you are using that 2% number, and depending what you’re using for an average return—we can sit and debate that all day—you are over-skewing the financial plan. At that point, you need a plan of hope because you’d better hope that inflation gets in check sooner than later and that you’re going to see 2% inflation. But that’s just not going to happen.

What Degree of Confidence Do You Have Financially?

Bud Kasper: From the longevity I’ve had in the business, I have a prediction of what I think could happen. I think some people are going to start questioning whether they’re getting all the necessary information that they need to have to have any degree of confidence. It can be incredibly difficult in this period we’re experiencing right now to that we’re experiencing right now to preserve that confidence.

That really raises the question again. Have you heard from your advisor lately? Because a lot of people are hiding under their desk because of a lack of performance associated with what’s been going on. And let’s face it, that is a huge challenge for all of us today. But it’s sometimes more important that you communicate during these difficult times than when things are going well.

Logan DeGraeve: Bud, I can’t emphasize that enough. It’s important to communicate regularly with your financial planner because your life is constantly changing. It’s critical that your financial planner is up to date with your retirement goals.

Getting to Know Retirees and Pre-Retirees on a Personal Level

For instance, last week I had a client tell me, “Hey, you know what? When the real estate market slows down a little bit, we might go get that house in Florida.” I said, “Great. How much are we going to spend on a down payment and those type of things? We’re going to need X, Y, and Z.”

It’s my job to figure out where X, Y, and Z is going to come from. I don’t want that money to be open to the market right now if we’re going to spend it in a year. So, it’s not just communicating what’s going on in the markets, going over a client’s returns, and assessing if their plan is on track. It’s important to keep up with what’s going on in their life.

Our reviews are pretty much give-and-take. I may talk half the time, the clients may talk half the time. Why? Because their life is changing all the time.

Bud Kasper: For years, I’ve said, “Don’t put money at risk where you have a short-term or near-term purpose.” That illustrates exactly what you were talking about. And sometimes, the answer unfortunately isn’t going to be positive because the numbers speak for themselves.

Understanding Tax Ramifications

Then, you need to overlap that with what’s going on in the economy and the things that are impacting the value of your investments. We can maybe even add more money to your pocketbook by understanding tax ramifications that we could get better control over.

Logan DeGraeve: Absolutely. Taxes are always going to be a matter of fact, no matter what the investment portfolio is doing. It’s a good time to start looking at tax planning. Tax planning is one of my favorite subjects. I’ve been going through probably five to 10 meetings a week with my clients to look at it.

Starting Off Summer with Some Tax Planning

I want to look at tax planning in May and June. Because if we start looking at tax planning in November, December, sometimes it’s too late or the hay is in the barn for the year. So, let’s have a general idea where we’re going to be at about the halfway point in the year. That gives us the ability to execute on things. Sometimes, it makes sense to do Roth conversions, which is a tool we talk about when the market is down.

Bud Kasper: Yeah. I’m so glad you brought that up. I just met with a client the other day and we were doing a Roth conversion. But we didn’t do all of it right now. We don’t know exactly what’s going to be happening toward the end of the year.

So, maybe do about 75% of where your anticipation would be for the entire year. Taxes and returns could change, so it’s worth considering a more prudent approach while sticking with the main goal. That goal, of course, is trying to take money away from Uncle Sam’s tax machine.

Logan DeGraeve: I couldn’t agree more. Get a game plan in place. Do some now, take advantage of things on discount, and then revisit later in the year. I think that that’s important, too. I think the reality is that when you’re going through returns with clients, some clients forget that the market can go down.

Bud Kasper: So true. That pressures the plan. But before this even occurred, you should have had some sense of direction as to how you would participate if the market is doing what it’s actually doing today.

What Will Be the Fed’s Next Move?

Logan, I’m going to go back and talk about the Federal Reserve since they are meeting next week. Let’s review how we’ve reached this point and share our what expectations for the Federal Reserve’s announcement might include next week.

Logan DeGraeve: Well, like Bud, Dean, and I have talked all about on previous shows, I think that the Federal Reserve waited a little too long to start raising interest rates.

Bud Kasper: I agree.

Logan DeGraeve: What we’ve seen so far is that we’re probably going to have rates increase at every meeting for the rest of the year. It’s not really going out on a limb to say this, but I would look for them to raise rates next week.

Bud Kasper: How much?

Logan DeGraeve: Probably 50 basis points.

Bud Kasper: Yeah. It’s baked into the numbers from that perspective. What’s the impact of that to individuals and couples?

Mortgage Applications Are at a 22-Year Low

Logan DeGraeve: Well, I was looking at CNBC’s website and saw that mortgage applications right now are at a 22-year low. I was a little taken back by that. That’s crazy given the housing market. There is still a housing shortage. But I think the reality is that people forget that mortgage rates matter.

Bud Kasper: You bet they do. For people that are thinking about selling their houses now, they need to understand that there’s not going to be as much demand. It got to the point of being ridiculous where people were bidding higher than what the owner was asking for. We had bidding wars that were going on with that. That will go away to a certain extent.

Now that interest rates are higher, it’s not as an attractive of a financial position to be in, but people still need homes. Because we don’t have an excess amount of inventory out there, when homes do come on a market, I think people will still be going out for them.

Things to Consider Right Now with Purchasing a Second Home or New Home

Logan DeGraeve: I think Bud makes a good point there. Let’s relate this back to getting financial clarity in uncertain times through financial planning. Let’s say someone is thinking about moving into a different home or picking up that vacation home. For the last couple years, it was in a lot of people’s best interest to take out a mortgage with interest rates being so low.

Now, you have some other decisions to make. Do you take out a mortgage? Do you maybe take out a good chunk of the investment portfolio that’s probably down? Is it IRA money that you’re going to need to take out substantially more than what you want to pay taxes? You potentially need to worry about Medicare premiums given ages and those type of things. I just named a whole bunch of things there. Without a financial plan, how can you answer those questions?

It All Goes Back to Your Financial Plan to Get Your Financial Clarity

Bud Kasper: You can’t. And that’s the problem is people make mistakes in financial decision making because they haven’t vetted it against a financial plan. That’s the takeaway with how to find financial clarity in uncertain times.

Of course, you would probably expect two CFP® Professionals to be talk about the necessity of financial planning, but I can’t underscore that enough. It’s the only source that can give you the truth and ability to understand the impact that this can have on your future. That’s especially true when you are in retirement.

Back to the Federal Reserve really quick. I agree with Logan with a 50 basis point hike. It’s already baked in into the numbers from that perspective. And then for their next meeting, it should be probably another 50 basis points.

So Much for Inflation Being Transitory

Do remember last year and even in the first couple of months of this year that they were saying that all this inflation would be transitory, meaning that short term. They’ve completely blown that out of the water at this point.

But as I share with clients, they will stop at some point. People use the term the Fed put. What that means is the Fed will start dropping rates if they think they need to so that the economy doesn’t stall out. That isn’t the primary objective of the Federal Reserve at this point, though. It’s get inflation in control. If we don’t, we’re going to be paying a higher price later.

Money Is Nothing More Than a Tool

So, how you’re reacting to this emotionally and from a planning perspective is essential. That’s why I’m bringing back up again the importance a comprehensive financial plan that accounts for all the various necessary applications to preserve your assets and put you on the right path.

Logan DeGraeve: When we talk about planning, it’s not just two CFP® Professionals geeking out over financial planning. I think we do a nice job of figuring out what’s important to retirees and pre-retirees. What do you want your money to do for you? Because at the end of the day, money is nothing more than a tool. It can make your life easier and is a tool to go do what you want to do.

Bud Kasper: Yeah. I like to have lots of tools.

Logan DeGraeve: As do most people. Part of that whole process when we’re meeting prospective clients is getting to know them. Because if we don’t get to know them, we can’t put them on the right track. I need to figure out what they want to do in retirement. What do you want life to look like?

There’s No Such Thing as Too Much Communication When Financial Planning

If you’re a financial planner and aren’t taking the time to sit down with your clients and understand how they think and feel about money, then you’re not doing a very good job of financial planning. Bud, how long have you known your longest-tenured client?

Bud Kasper: Oh, probably 36 years.

Logan DeGraeve: Thirty-six years. Over the course of those years, you start building relationships. You know how certain clients think and feel about money. If the Dow Jones Industrial Average falls 1,000 points, you could probably pick out a couple of your clients that would be more likely to call you than not. It helps you do your job better.

Bud Kasper: Absolutely. This is the time when communication needs to be excessive.

How Much Risk Should YOU Be Taking?

Logan DeGraeve: Once again, the investment plan and financial plan should be in unison. I always say they should be married together because you only need to take as much risk as you need to accomplish your goals. Just because your neighbors taking 80% stock market risk doesn’t mean you need to.

At the end of the day, if you are uncomfortable with everything that’s going on, get that second opinion. Figure out how much risk you need to take. You may be taking more unnecessary risk and have a little bit more anxiety than you need. And I’m not saying that you need to get less risky, but it might be an option.

Bud Kasper: Yeah. And please remember that a plan is not the investment solution. A plan accounts for any financial position that could impact your retirement. That would look at Social Security integration, possible taxation on Social Security, Medicare, how to avoid getting a higher Medicare amount than others. Help me out with some other things that a plan accounts for, Logan.

Logan DeGraeve: Insurance—property and casualty. It’s making sure that there are no gaps. There’s estate planning. Make sure you have all the documents in place. The reality is that a proper financial plan looks at the investments, tax planning, insurance planning, etc. Bud and I both hate insurance, but it’s something that we all need at some point.

Bud Kasper: It’s a necessity for some parts of your planning.

Logan DeGraeve: With the estate planning process, I don’t care how old you are, everyone needs some level of estate planning.

Did You Harvest Some Gains from Last Year’s Great Returns?

Bud Kasper: And everybody needs some sort of a plan. We have been discussing so many things today because there’s so much going on in this world. All of this to varying degrees is impacting what’s happening to people’s money, especially for those who are retired.

There’s no doubt that there were some nice returns last year. But people who let it ride and didn’t change their allocation might have a harder time remembering those nice returns since they wouldn’t have done any harvesting.

Here Today, Gone Tomorrow

Logan DeGraeve: I’m a big proponent of making sure that all your money is not invested the same way. When I work with clients, I like having a short-term, midterm, and long-term bucket of money. With years like last year and that long-term bucket of money does really well, let’s take a little bit of gain off that table and put it into the mid-term bucket. The mid-term bucket maybe made 14%, 15% last year, so let’s spill that down to the short-term bucket of money.

What that does is allow you right now to be spending gain that you’ve harvested from previous years. It’s just a smart thing to do. Because if you didn’t do that, you’ve given up all the gain you’ve had last year if you didn’t change your allocation. That’s just probably the reality of it that you’re back to zero.

Bud Kasper: Here today, gone tomorrow.

Logan DeGraeve: Absolutely. When we’re sitting down with clients a couple times a year, we’re having conversations about how much money they think they’re going to spend next year. Well, let’s get that in a safer position. It can prevent possible anxiety from spending money on stocks that are losing. You don’t need to do that. Because you don’t lose until you sell.

Risk Changes with Time

Bud Kasper: Yeah. That’s true. But in the same token, you need to know where your level of exposure is and what your true risk is. Let’s face it. Risk changes with time.

Last year, we were riding high and everything looked absolutely perfect from an investment perspective. Then, we cross over into the new year. We have all this anxiety, all these challenges that are in front of us. If you have the same portfolio right now that you had last year, you probably have experienced a fair degree of pain already.

My question to those people is why are you still in that portfolio? Do you think the economy, markets, and assets in general are going reverse and go back to where they were 12 months ago? I don’t think so. And if that’s the case, especially for you retirees, you better be going in and safeguarding this.

Watch Out for the Insurance Guarantees

Now, one of the other things that bugs the tar out of me are some of the people selling insurance right now that are talking about guarantees, guarantees, guarantees. Well, guarantee is a beautiful word. People like to hear that. Even I like to hear that, but I don’t find the solutions in products.

What I mean by that is they’re selling out of a fear situation. And there’s plenty of fear from that perspective. But remember, if you’re going into something like that that is fixed rate and inflation is going at the pace that it is, it’s eroding that return.

Logan DeGraeve: You’re losing money at that point. That’s a good point. In times of uncertainty, people make emotional decisions if they don’t have financial clarity from their plan.

Bud Kasper: And how would they get the financial clarity?

Logan DeGraeve: Getting a financial plan. Times of uncertainty like this are when insurance salesmen and people like that do kind of prey on people. Before you make any decisions, get a plan done. Make sure you’re on the right track. And to Bud’s point, if your allocation needs to change, that’s great. But let’s figure out. Can we take less risk? Because the answer is probably.

The Big Conundrum

Bud Kasper: It might be a necessity from that perspective. Therein lies a bit of the conundrum that we’re facing. The traditional place that we would generally go to for safety and income would be the bond market. Bonds are not our friends right now, unless you’re in the very shortest maturities. And even those returns are somewhat challenged this year.

So, a lay person who says they’re going to be 60% stocks and 40% bonds or reverse, they have not had a return sequence that has provided the returns they had hoped for. In fact, there is strong probability that they’re losing money.

Logan DeGraeve: And this is not investment advice by any means. But let’s talk about a 60/40 portfolio as an example. We all understand that the stock market’s struggled so far, but what a lot of clients don’t really understand is that bond component. Again, this isn’t investment advice, but just look at the bond aggregate since it’s what is looked at for a 60/40 allocation. The bond aggregate has lost 9.5% this year.

Where to Go for Safety in the Quest for Financial Clarity

So, some people might think that they’re conservative investors, but are still wondering why they are down 70% or 80% of what the stock market is when they’re only taking 40% or 50% of the market risk? It’s because the bonds aren’t doing what the bonds are supposed to do. Therefore, the question is where do people go in times like this?

Bud Kasper: Yeah. It could be cash or commodities of some sort. Again, I don’t want to be soliciting for investments, but these are natural questions that people want to have answers for.

Logan DeGraeve: Bud makes a good point with that. We’ve talked about this 60/40 allocation and the problems with that with long-term projections. People that are doing this on their own come to us and have the adage of taking out 4% of their portfolio every year.

Understanding Sequence of Returns and Safe Withdrawal Rates

Basically, if they have $1 million and are going to take 4% out, that’s $40,000 a year. They line this up on a spreadsheet and see they have an average return of 8%. The problem with that, though, is they’re not getting 8% this year.

Bud Kasper: That’s right. If you can’t identify that in your plan, you’re going to be whipsawed and unpleasantly surprised.

Making the Necessary Course Corrections in Your Financial Plan

Logan DeGraeve: Depending on what happens this year, if their $1 million goes to $850,000 and they don’t adjust that $40,000 number, they took out a lot more than 4%. It’s not just straight-line math. It’s looking at the software that we use and looking at the best of best returns and the worst of worst returns.

What I want to know is what needs to happen for my clients to run out of money? We’ll make course corrections along the way because I don’t want to be the financial planner that has their clients pass away with $10 million if they don’t want to. But at the same time, we don’t want to run out of money. So, we need to make course corrections and keep people within those guardrails.

We Are Here to Help You Find Financial Clarity

Bud Kasper: Those are excellent points, Logan. And remember, our purpose of this discussion is to find financial clarity during uncertain times. That uncertainty includes the stock market, interest rates, etc. If you’re looking to find financial clarity during these uncertain times, you can by schedule a 20-minute “Ask Anything” Session or complimentary consultation with one of our CERTIFIED FINANCIAL PLANNER™ Professionals. We can meet with you in person, by phone, or virtually.

I hope Logan and I did that today in some way, shape, or form. We have a great program that we’re setting up for next week. Dean will be back in studio with us and we’ll be sharing that information at that time. Logan, thanks so much for being here again.

Logan DeGraeve: Thank you, Bud. I had a blast.

Bud Kasper: Good. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you so much for joining us for America’s Wealth Management Show. It’s been our pleasure to be with you today. I’m Bud Kasper, along with Logan DeGraeve. Have a great day.

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The views expressed represent the opinion of Modern Wealth Management an SEC Registered Investment Advisor. Information provided is for illustrative purposes only and does not constitute investment, tax, or legal advice. Modern Wealth Management does not accept any liability for the use of the information discussed. Consult with a qualified financial, legal, or tax professional prior to taking any action.